CALDWELL'S TAKE CALDWELL & PARKS WEEKLY CHAT 1/7: Jericho's return, Cena-Kane, Bryan heel or face, "one of the most forgettable & pointless main events in some time," Impact, Genesis
Jan 7, 2012 - 11:36:12 AM
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On a weekly basis, PWTorch staffers James Caldwell and Greg Parks have a casual, yet insightful, Lounge-style chat reviewing the week in TV wrestling and looking ahead to what's next for key storylines, matches, and future events. An occasional "Seinfeld" or "The Office" reference is also mixed in for good measure.
James Caldwell: This is PWTorch assistant editor James Caldwell joined by PWTorch columnist Greg Parks for a discussion of this week's TV wrestling. Greg, Smackdown just wrapped up, so let's start with the show you covered tonight, and we have to start with Mark Henry on commentary for the main event. Your thoughts on Henry's performance and the outcome of Daniel Bryan-Big Show for the World Title, with more seeds planted for Bryan turning heel?
Greg Parks: A++++ Would Listen To Commentating Again. Seriously, though, Henry regained any tough-man cred he had lost by being booked more like a chicken heel and losing the title to Big Show at TLC by shining on commentary as an absolute bad-ass. Bryan was receiving some heel heat after the match, and he's playing this role pretty well, I must say. I'm still not sure why they figure they need to turn him heel, though; the last thing WWE needs is another heel who keeps winning by the skin of his teeth or by getting DQ'ed/counted out, etc.
Caldwell: Do you think Bryan could still pull it off and retain some credibility because he has a killer arsenal of offense? I think he has an advantage in that area over, say, The Miz. But, I'm with you that I'm not sold on Bryan doing the heel turn, even if it's sort of an oblivious one where he can't figure out why the audience is against him since he feels he hasn't changed.
Parks: Yeah, that would be a little different take on it at least, as opposed to generic heel turn promo #1 where the heel blames the fans. I do agree that at least he looks credible in the ring to a certain extent, but every time you have Cole calling him a nerd or Henry saying Bryan belongs in the midget division, I think that somewhat negates whatever credibility his offense provides him.
Caldwell: Good point. It's a bit too much like a Kurt Angle promo wanting two X Division guys for a warm-up match. And, I think Christian wore out heel turn promo #1 last year. I like that label - I'm going to call on you to use it during upcoming Livecasts! ... Does the teased heel turn at least give him more of a chance to be long-term champion (at least to WM28) or do you think he drops the title on a Smackdown or PPV before Mania?
Parks: We talked a little about this at the Livecast, and I just don't know if Bryan as either champion or challenger heading into 'Mania as a heel would work as well as if he's a face. If he's a heel. I just think there's more money in underdog babyface Bryan than underdog heel Bryan. It would work either way as a babyface at 'Mania - he could be champion trying to defend his turf against 'Mania when few would give him a chance to retain; or he could go in as the underdog babyface challenging whomever for the title. The last scenario has lost some steam since he won his first title, since ideally you would've had him win it the first time at 'Mania. But, I think either of those options are better than heel Daniel Bryan defending or challenging for the belt.
Caldwell: I think the fear with Heel Bryan is that as soon as Bryan drops the title, he'll start drifting down the card to where he was before the TLC PPV. At least with Bryan as a face, he could still be the scrappy underdog with a legit shot and fan support to re-visit the title picture. If Bryan holds the title all the way to Mania, who do you see as the opponent(s)? I'm thinking Show and Henry will remain in the title picture for a while, but Show seems to be eying Shaq and they wouldn't do tweener/heel Bryan vs. Henry. Someone else, perhaps Orton vs. Bryan?
Parks: I guess, but that doesn't have much juice (of course, they have plenty of time to build it up). I still think face Bryan vs. heel Henry is the way to go, and heel Bryan vs. Big Show just doesn't "feel" like a WM match. I don't see any other big faces on the Smackdown side who would make sense with the heel Bryan.
Caldwell: Even Sheamus vs. Bryan doesn't "feel" like the way to go. Right now, Orton, Sheamus, and Barrett seem lumped together in a program just below the World Title, with none of them really taking strides toward the title picture, even if Barrett talks about wanting to be the first Englishman World champion. What did you think of the Orton-Barrett follow-up from last week's show and how they handled a murky injury situation with Orton?
Parks: They didn't really shed much more light on how long he'll be sidelined, but I don't think that was the expectation going in either. It looks like they may fill the time with Barrett vs. Sheamus while Orton is out. WWE had the foresight to build Sheamus up even without a feud, which was smart of course because now they can plug him in here. If only WWE had done this more often.
Caldwell: Indeed. They would have a roster filled with ready-made stars, rather than being in panic mode when Raw wrestlers are unavailable for a Smackdown taping. Another big item on Smackdown was the Rhodes-Booker IC Title match. A nice, solid 12 minutes with a clean finish for Rhodes. Did it feel like the end of the feud, at least in the ring?
Parks: It did, especially with the camera lingering on a sad Booker after the match. Looks like they're moving toward Cody vs. Goldust. To be honest, Rhodes getting a clean win over Booker to end the feud is how it should've gone. Plus they had Hunico get a solid win, Primo & Epico got a non-title win to continue to build tag-team cred, and even Jinder Mahal stood tall over Sheamus. When was the last time a mid-card heel stood tall over an upper card/main event babyface?
Caldwell: Especially when Sheamus is involved! He's been booked strong for months that it actually seemed to make a difference for Jinder. But, with the tag division, are Primo & Epico ever going to get the Tag Titles or is WWE just going to book the same Air Boom-P&E tag matches for the next five months? It's time to do something or move on, right? On the Cody-Goldust front, it's the match Goldust has been campaigning for at Mania, but do you think they have the match before Mania at this pace?
Parks: I don't mind the extended feud, other than the fact there's nothing really behind it other than the in-ring aspect - they need to integrate Rosa more into the story, which they seemed to start tonight. With the amount of TV and PPVs WWE produces, it's hard to believe WWE could hold off the first match of a feud that's starting now, until WrestleMania. So I have my doubts, but they could do it, I suppose.
Caldwell: That's my concern, too, that WWE won't be able to hold off on Rhodes-Goldust until Mania. They could do the ol' one match, re-match, rubber match at Mania routine, but I feel this would be better off as a one-time-only match-up at Mania, even if they could use the first two matches to up the ante to Goldust's career on the line at Mania. We'll see how it plays out. Anything else stood out from Smackdown this week?
Parks: What happened to Natalya? They've seemingly separated her from Beth Phoenix and now she's losing to Tamina. Is this WWE just wanting to push someone new in Tamina, or is Nattie in the doghouse?
Caldwell: I think WWE is back to viewing Natalya as a dependable wrestler to help enhance other Divas, but not someone they have faith in to build around or spotlight. I think it's safe to say they're higher on Tamina right now than Natalya. Perhaps it sets up Tamina for an eventual Divas Title challenge now that they've soured on A. Fox?
Parks: Possibly, but it seems the Divas Title feuds are exclusively on Raw. Luckily, with the Supershow concept, Tamina can go to Raw and challenge for the title no questions asked!
Caldwell: Perhaps she could just switch brands like Kane, Show, McIntyre, and others, and no one would even notice! All right, let's move on to Monday's Raw. Of course, the big topic was Chris Jericho's return. I've read and heard so many mixed reviews - brilliant, too clever, great way to set up his return, the joke was on him, etc. Where do you fall?
Parks: I'm positive, but of course, hesitantly. I feel like too often we say, "follow-up is key," but here, it truly is. He needs to explain his actions for the fans who may not have understood what he was trying to do. Heck, a lot of fans who love it now hated it while it was happening, and only upon reflection figured out what Jericho was doing (or what we suspect he was trying to do). So I'm positive pending follow-up. How about you?
Caldwell: I started out indifferent, then we talked it out on the Livecast yesterday and I moved to a slight thumbs up. But, I think the problem with the "promo" is that it comes in an era where so much of the audience is just there to watch and not invest, or just be part of the show because they're on TV. So, it seemed a bit too cute for today's WWE audience, which really didn't pick up on what Jericho was trying to do, but Jericho could really hit a home run next week after introducing his new persona. If you were booking Week 2, would you have Jericho talk or would you have him continue being silent until WWE gets a full audience to figure it out and boo him, then have him talk?
Parks: The second scenario could end up blowing up in WWE's face if the crowd doesn't react how they want them too, so the first one would be much easier to control. I know we talked about having him come out and do the same thing again, but will it further confuse fans who didn't understand what was going on in the first place? For such a bizarre segment, the announcers pretended it didn't happen in the next segment, and didn't address it tonight - in fact, they did show a video of Jericho's celebration touting his comeback on an ad, but didn't hint anything about him being a heel and basically showed the fans cheering and him celebrating with them. Strange situation.
Caldwell: Strange, indeed. Probably the strangest part is the lack of acknowledgement or descriptions by the announcers. Do you think it sets up a confrontation between Jericho and Laurinaitis to get answers, or will Jericho sort of be on an island until they set up something with Jericho and wrestler, such as Punk?
Parks: A confrontation between Laurinaitis and Jericho would be heel vs. heel, and I think they want to get Jericho over as a strong heel, so they wouldn't put him in a position to have the crowd choose between him and Laurinaitis. If they do want to set up Punk vs. Jericho at WM, they could do that any day because aside from Laurinaitis, Punk doesn't really have much to do as far as an opponent.
Caldwell: And they have a few weeks to let Punk and Dolph Ziggler interact before their title re-match at the Rumble, so there's no rush to get to Jericho vs. Punk. Unlike Kane's reintroduction, WWE can really take their time with Jericho's re-intro. Speaking of Kane, your thoughts on WWE dipping into the ol' bag of magic tricks with Kane involving Cena and now Ryder?
Parks: Ah yes, Ziggler. I did forget about him. That doesn't feel like a long-term situation though, one that would take place at 'Mania. I can understand why people rolled their eyes at the ending of Raw, but like Wade Keller said, you sort of have to give WWE some creative license with that Kane character, as he's one of the few who WWE has consistently gone to the "mystical, over-the-top" well with. I don't think it's cutting edge programming that will bring the young fans in, but at least it's something different.
Caldwell: At the same time, I've heard the argument made that Kane's mystical-ness can't exist in the same "Reality Era" that C.M. Punk ushered in - for better or worse. Can they still go there with Kane, as long as it's sort of on its own island on WWE TV?
Parks: Vince McMahon has often said WWE has "something for everyone." You have the R-Truth segments stalking Miz, the comedy, and you've got the Kane segments, then the CM Punk segments. That's like how WWE uses Hornswoggle to give the kiddies something to see, but also has more serious main event angles, and the high-flyers in the tag division, etc. They try to offer something for everyone and I don't know that it's working, but that's a discussion for another day.
Caldwell: Indeed. As for Cena's "inner conflict" storyline, are they getting closer to Cena "giving in" and trying to fight fire with fire? Or, do you think he'll continue to stand his grand and keep cutting the exact same babyface promo about the fans, people paying their money to boo him, etc.?
Parks: I see no signs of Cena thinking about turning heel. He had the perfect opportunity on Raw to turn on Zack Ryder or let him fall into the abyss, but it didn't happen. If it was to happen, Cena had the chance handed to him on a silver platter and he passed.
Caldwell: The thought running through my mind was that Cena would try, but fail to rescue Ryder, then he would be forced to start thinking about taking shortcuts to combat Kane. But, Super Cena made the save and everything was back to normal. So, it will be interesting to see how this progresses as they desperately try to get to WM28 to have the Cena vs. Rock match. Greg, what else stood out to you from Raw?
Parks: To be honest, not much. Shall we move on to Impact or is there something from Raw I'm forgetting?
Caldwell: The only other things were really Truth stalking Miz, which you mentioned, the head-shaking Divas tag match, and the main event handicap tag match, which really didn't make sense with the heels being placed at a disadvantage with Jack Swagger having to hold up the heel side. I think WWE quickly tried to get away from the handicap match to finish Raw with the Kane-Cena/Ryder bit, so I don't think much harm was done there.
Parks: The handicap match was truly one of the most forgettable and pointless Raw main events in some time.
Caldwell: Well, there you go! Right to the point. I like it. And your thoughts on the Divas match?
Parks: I have none.
Caldwell: I don't blame you. Rough night. All right, Greg, let's talk some Impact before the Genesis PPV on Sunday. They book-ended the show with six of the top wrestlers on the PPV in the opening segment and in the main event. What did you think of the top segment/angle/match on the show?
Parks: It was fine. I'm still not clear on the whole Immortal/Bobby Roode combination as I think they could explain that better. And I didn't like the non-finish in the main event since they do that way too often. The main event is usually just a big angle, so they've got some work to do there.
Caldwell: Did you see them do anything to create interest for the top matches at the PPV, like Roode-Hardy and/or Angle-Storm? Or, is it yet another TNA PPV that will be ordered by the regulars, only, with no real interest from casual fans?
Parks: Definitely only hardcores for this one; putting on my casual fan hat, I see nothing that would entice me to buy this over any other standard TNA PPV offering.
Caldwell: Elsewhere on Impact, there seemed to be some repeat material on the fourth show of a three-TV taping set last month just trying to get to the PPV. With the big stars packed into the main event, did anything else stand out in the middle of the show?
Parks: Nothing really at all. I watched it just last night and can barely remember anything about it 24 hours later. I remember Kaz apparently turning on AJ, which was dumb. But that's about it.
Caldwell: Yeah, I didn't get that. I don't see how it helps Kaz at all. And, does anyone like A.J. Styles? TNA books him where he can't get a break or keep a friend.
Parks: He seems to be really lost in the shuffle after kind of being forgotten following his brief feud with Roode.
Caldwell: Similar to Samoa Joe, who's at least on the PPV in a Tag Title match. Meanwhile, A.J. is going from back-to-back PPV main events to not being on this month's card. So, what a mess for the annual Wrestlers of the Year in the mid-2000s. Greg, that's all I have for this week. Tell us about this weekend's Gonzo & The Greg show.
Parks: This week on Gonzo & the Greg, we'll be delivering our top five predictions for 2012 in wrestling. Mute football tomorrow and listen to our show while watching the playoffs!
Caldwell: Speaking of which, Texans Playoffs Debut just hours away! It's been a long time coming. As always, Greg, a pleasure to begin the New Year. We'll chat it up next week with potentially some words from Chris Jericho to examine.
Parks: Sounds good, and the Texans are my team to root for now - they've got three Badgers on their team, most of anyone in the playoffs, so I've adopted them for the playoffs.
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