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Torch Flashbacks
WWE NO MERCY ROUNDTABLE 5 YEARS AGO (10-19-03): Keller, Mitchell, McNeill, Powell rate and review PPV event
Oct 5, 2008 - 4:22:17 PM


Bruce Mitchell, Torch columnist (7.0)

Nice of Mr. McMahon to use his 58 year body as a living tribute to the late Michael Hegstrand...

It’s a shame that Vince’s Wedding Present hype overshadowed what turned out to be a solid effort from everyone on the roster. All eyes were on John Cena, who came through with the best match of the night with Kurt Angle. Cena is putting all the pieces together to become a real main eventer.

The Undertaker-Brock Lesnar match was a good big man match, but I wonder if Lesnar knows he's just a stand-in for Mr. McMahon.

Tajiri vs Rey Mysterio was a good match and I look forward to the Yazuka team adding something to the Buzzsaw's act (and hopefully we won't see some corny feud with the FBI.) Zach Gowen's win came out of nowhere (I don't get that) but he was great. Chris Benoit and A-Train was watchable. The APA vs. The Bashams wasn't much but at least the right team won.

And you know, under different circumstances, the Father-Daughter nonsense could have been a nice sidedish to a wrestling entree. Boy, that Vince-Taker feud ought to be something, huh?

Pat McNeill, Torch columnist (6.0)

This was a better than expected show. But we should all stop acting surprised whenever WWE puts on a PPV that isn't a total embarrassment to the business. The best match tonight was Kurt Angle's match with John Cena. Cena continued on his road to becoming a future main eventer and you can't point at anything particularly wrong with his performance tonight, but it wasn't really the sort of breakout match you'd expect from somebody people are touting as the next Rock or Steve Austin.

There wasn't really a bad match on the show. The most disappointing of the eight matches had to be Eddie Guerrero against Big Show, especially since we've seen better matches from Show during this year.

I really like the idea of having post-match interviews with victorious wrestlers. Hopefully this will become a regular feature. The top observation of the night goes to Tazz who helpfully pointed out that in order to beat Undertaker in the chain match, Lesnar needed to get the chain. That's why they call him a broadcast journalist.

Here is the problem with tonight's booking. Outside of Kurt Angle and maybe Chris Benoit, none of the fan favorites were made to look strong coming out of the PPV. Unless we're heading toward Kurt Angle vs. Brock Lesnar again at Survivor Series, I don't understand the rationale for several of the decisions that were made tonight.

Jason Powell, Torch assistant editor (5.0)

Undertaker vs. Brock Lesnar was a lackluster match that didn't even measure up to the last two Raw pay-per-view main events. And when you take into account that Goldberg was in those Raw main events, that really says something about Taker vs. Lesnar. And it's not like Taker and Lesnar haven't come through with a good match before. Around this time last year, Lesnar and Taker put together a strong Hell in a Cell match. What was different this time around is that the chain gimmick was weak compared to Hell in a Cell, Paul Heyman wasn't at ringside, and this match was all about Taker.

Last year, Taker did an admirable job of putting the focus on Lesnar. Taker even cut a promo the next week in which he all admitted that he had been beaten by a better man. Taker even hinted that Father Time was catching up to him when he added that it may have been a different story had he been in his prime when he faced off against Lesnar. This time around, Taker showed off all of his submission moves while dominating the champion. During his first promo on Smackdown, he won't say that he was beaten by a better man, but rather that he would have won the WWE Title if it hadn't been for Vince McMahon and The FBI. And if Taker doesn't say it himself, the announcers will surely say it for him.

The question I have is whether this was a move made by Taker or whether it was Vince McMahon. After all, Taker wasn't the only one overshadowing Lesnar. Vince didn't put his match with Stephanie in the main event slot, but the advertising for this event made it pretty clear which match Vince considered the true show stealer. And in a way, Vince did steal this show. He took the spotlight away from the WWE Champion and the rest of the real wrestlers and shined it directly on himself, ensuring himself another large pay day when he and Taker square off at Survivor Series. Steph may be taking a break, but there's no sign of the McMahon domination of television time coming to an end any time soon.

Notes: Rey Mysterio vs. Tajiri had a very good match, but it wasn't much different than what they've done for free on Smackdown. Same with Chris Benoit and A-Train for that matter. WWE needs to stop giving away these matches so that there is some incentive for the fans to pay for these shows... Zach Gowen's win over Matt Hardy was not the major event it could have been. I've been saying for months that WWE should have built to Gowen's first win as a singles wrestler over time. They finally acknowledged his losing streak, only to give away his first victory in a forgettable manner. So what's next for Zach now that he's just another wrestler?... Is there a reason the announcers have to refer to Vince as "Mr. McMahon" at all times? I know the point is supposed to be that they live in fear of their boss, but it's almost laughable when they give him the respect of calling him "Mr. McMahon" in the same breath that they refer to him as a sick monster... Replay Factor: Nah, hold out for Survivor Series...

Wade Keller, Torch editor (6.0)

This was a good show that benefited from low expectations, but I think actually delivered less than I personally expected. I thought Angle could get more out of Cena than he did. It was a very good match, but not at the ***3/4 or **** level that I thought Cena needed to move into a solid top tier slot as a WWE main eventer. Undertaker vs. Brock was 5 or 10 minutes longer than it needed to be or should have been. There was just too much punching and stomping for fifteen minutes with both wrestlers switching between first and second gear. There needed to be more crescendos early on to ignite the crowd and PPV viewer's energy.

Guerrero vs. Show okay given the size difference. Even though Guerrero is a better, more experienced worker than Brock, he doesn't have the size to have as good of a match with Show as Brock has had. It was still a worthwhile, entertaining match, but there was so much potential for them to play off of Show being humiliated before, and giving Guerrero some great spots to continue to humiliate Show even more. It seems as if the writers didn't get as into booking spots in this match as they did booking angles to hype the match. We needed some Big Show facial expressions for comedy when Guerrero outsmarted him, but we didn't get that. I did like the post-match interview with Show, who made the U.S. Title seem like a big deal.

The Matt Hardy vs. Zach Gowen finish threw me. I didn't expect it and still don't get it. Did Matt's WWE contract run out and he's headed to TNA? The clean win wasn't even believable. A simple moonsault knocked Matt completely out? The only saving grace can be if Matt "threw" the match on purpose to mess with Zach, but even then that would cheapen the selling point of all matches, which is that heels (or anyone) hate to lose under any circumstances. Hardy is main event, Zach is novelty. Both can be money players, but Hardy shouldn't be jobbing to Zach clean.

I would have put the Bashams vs. APA on first, and saved the Cruiserweight Title match until after Big Show's U.S. Title win over Guerrero. The Cruiserweight Title, to mean anything, has to be treated as something special. I'm not a believer that the opener has to be a fast-paced energetic yet meaningless match. I think an opener can just be a basic warm-up tag match like APA vs. Bashams could have been.

Steph vs. Vince was what it was. It was nice comedy relief. They did a nice job with it. They didn't overstay their welcome. Too bad the TV hype was so over-the-top heading into the match.


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MORE "Torch Flashbacks" ARTICLES
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KELLER'S WWE SURVIVOR SERIES PPV REPORT 10 YRS. AGO (11-14-99): Big Show vs. Triple H vs. The Rock, Edge & Christian & Hardys team, Chris Jericho vs. Chyna
KELLER'S WWF SURVIVOR SERIES PPV REPORT 15 YRS. AGO (11-23-94): Bret Hart vs. Bob Backlund, Undertaker vs. Yokozuna, Team Hall & Waltman vs. Team Michaels & Nash
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Articles Grouped by Category
Torch Today
WWE RAW 11/16: Place Your Bets on tonight's Raw - Week 12 featuring Roddy Piper
WWE RAW 11/2: "Place your Bets" Scoreboard after Week 11 - Review the previous scores before tonight's Raw PYB contest
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WWE News
WWE News: What's on Smackdown tonight - Taker & Kane vs. Big Show & Jericho
WWE News: Jim Ross comments on possible WrestleMania 26 return, current WWE contract status
TORCH TALK DAILY with Eric Bischoff: In-depth look at why Vince McMahon is marketing the WWE product as PG family-friendly
TNA News
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ROH News
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RADICAN'S DGUSA "Untouchable" PPV review - Doi vs. Danielson, Shingo vs. Richards
10/25 WWE Bragging Rights Results: KELLER'S detailed match-by-match PPV report - Cena vs. Orton Iron Man match
TV Reports
PARKS' WWE SMACKDOWN REPORT 11/20: Ongoing "virtual time" coverage of the show, including Jericho & Show vs. Undertaker & Kane
CALDWELL'S WWE SUPERSTARS TV REPORT 11/19: Complete coverage of Henry vs. Rhodes on WGN
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MMA / UFC Coverage
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MOJO MITCHELL'S WWE RAW 11/16: Stream of Piper In The Back, Hornswoggle Stabbed in the Back, An MSG Look Back, Mr. McMahon Backs Out, Kofi Kingston Backs Randy Orton Up
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Fight For Your Right to Bragging: McNEILL Previews WWE Bragging Rights!
CALDWELL'S TAKE
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CALDWELL'S TUESDAY CHAT w/GREG PARKS: Raw, Smackdown, TNA PPV discussion - MSG crowd, Survivor Series hype, Kofi breaks out, CSI:Miami vs. 30 Rock
CALDWELL'S BLOG: Hitting the hot topics - Raw tonight, Turning Point vs. Survivor Series, Jesse Ventura, Brock Lesnar, Shane McMahon
RADICAN'S TAKE
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RADICAN'S SHIMMER Vol. 23 Review - Busic-Melissa, Kong-Martinez, MsChif-Deeb
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The Specialists
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UNDER THE MICROSCOPE - TNA Impact 11/19: Forgotten history between A.J. and Angle, TNA's new cameras, Pope gets referee assist, Numbers - The Rock a horrible tag champ
HITS & MISSES - TNA IMPACT 11/12: Review of last week's show before tonight's Impact - Wolfe-Angle build-up, Lethal loses to Niedhart
Guest Editorials
GUEST EDITORIAL: Disgruntled TNA fan says he's done with the promotion after today's Impact taping (Contains SPOILERS)
GUEST EDITORIAL: The ultimate irony - Hulk Hogan appears on TNA Impact and pre-taped TV sitcom promoting WWE on the same night
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Torch Feedback
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Ask the Editor
Ask the Editor: Wouldn't incorporating MMA-style holds into pro wrestling matches just be trying to be something it's not?
ASK THE EDITOR: Have the Michaels-Batista promos crossed a line with use of insider terms, references to "jobs"?
ASK THE EDITOR: Why do wrestlers in WWE refer to wrestling as "the business" and not "the sport"?
DVDs - VGames - Books
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RADICAN'S ROH DVD REVIEW SERIES: Death Before Dishonor VII: N2 - Storm-Hero, Ryan-Cabana
RADICAN'S SHIMMER Vol. 23 Review - Busic-Melissa, Kong-Martinez, MsChif-Deeb
Torch Flashbacks
PARKS'S WWE SMACKDOWN REPORT 1 YR. AGO (11-21-08): Final Survivor Series build-up to Undertaker vs. Big Show casket match, Jeff Hardy vs. Triple H, Morrison & Miz
KELLER'S WWE SURVIVOR SERIES PPV REPORT 10 YRS. AGO (11-14-99): Big Show vs. Triple H vs. The Rock, Edge & Christian & Hardys team, Chris Jericho vs. Chyna
KELLER'S WWF SURVIVOR SERIES PPV REPORT 15 YRS. AGO (11-23-94): Bret Hart vs. Bob Backlund, Undertaker vs. Yokozuna, Team Hall & Waltman vs. Team Michaels & Nash
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Torch Instant Polls
SMACKDOWN POLL: Who was the MVP of the 11/20 Smackdown if you saw the show?
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ECW MVP POLL: Who was the MVP of the 11/17 ECW TV if you saw the show?
PWTorch Free Podcast
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Annual Obituaries
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SPECIALIST: List of Deceased Wrestlers for 2000 - Solie, Albright, Duncum, Tsuruta, Blue Demon, Al Costello
SPECIALIST: List of Deceased Wrestlers for 2001: Johnny Valentine, Terry Gordy, Chris Adams, Bertha Faye, Helen Hart